Interview
Tariq Ali: Let’s start with Gaza. We are in what is hopefully the final stage of this Israeli war. Its toll in casualties is going to be in the hundreds of thousands, perhaps close to half a million. No Western country has made any meaningful attempt to stop it. Last month, Trump ordered the Israelis to sign the ceasefire deal with Iran and when Israel broke it he was enraged. To use his immortal words: ‘They don’t know what the fuck they’re doing.’ But that leads me to the question: do you think the Americans know what the fuck they’re doing?
Jean-Luc Mélenchon: We must try to understand the rationale of these Western states. It’s not simply that Trump is crazy or that the Europeans are cowards; maybe they are those things, but what they are doing is nonetheless based on a long-term plan, one that has failed in the past but is now in the process of being realized. The plan is, first, to reorganize the entire Middle East to secure access to oil for the countries of the Global North; and, second, to create the conditions for war with China.
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